Category Archives: Debates

State-Run Programs for the Poor, or Individual Responsibility for Helping Those in Need?

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The following debate originally took place on my Facebook wall, upon my post, “Paying Taxes Will NEVER Qualify as Giving to “Charity””…

Rayn: Wake up to the illegitimacy of coercion!

"It's amazing to me how many people think that voting to have the government give poor people money is compassion. Helping poor and suffering people yourself is compassion. Voting for our government to use guns to give money to help poor and suffering people is immoral self-righteous bullying laziness. People need to be fed, medicated, educated, clothed, and sheltered. If we're compassionate, we'll help them, but you get no moral credit for forcing other people to do what you think is right. There is great joy in helping people, but no joy in doing it at gunpoint." - Penn Jillette

“It’s amazing to me how many people think that voting to have the government give poor people money is compassion. Helping poor and suffering people yourself is compassion. Voting for our government to use guns to give money to help poor and suffering people is immoral self-righteous bullying laziness. People need to be fed, medicated, educated, clothed, and sheltered. If we’re compassionate, we’ll help them, but you get no moral credit for forcing other people to do what you think is right. There is great joy in helping people, but no joy in doing it at gunpoint.” – Penn Jillette

Brian K.: But for the people in need of being fed, medicated, educated, clothed, and sheltered it’s all the same. Self-righteous joy and moral credit (kind of defeats the purpose of altruism) is a luxury. I think their immediate needs are greater than leaving it to the chance of charity and some generous volunteers.

Rayn: Hmm… I have a quick question for you, Brian. Have you ever been one of the “people in need” that you refer to? Well, I have – and, I can say for certain that the various forms of assistance out there in this world are not “all the same,” as you claim. This is true no matter how dire the individual situation at hand. And, forcing an apathetic public to finance a corrupt, soulless institution (whether the “State,” or otherwise), purely in the HOPE and FAITH that a lack of direct concern for (and interest in) the ACTUAL welfare of others will miraculously translate into anything other than systemic ABUSE, NEGLECT, AND FRAUD… Those individuals are living in a PURE FANTASY LAND!

My experiences have long ago opened my eyes to the fact that those hired by the State to “aid” the needy not only loath the poor and destitute, but also actively seek to punish, demean, degrade, demoralize, and strip the dignity of those they are duty-bound to assist. State aid for the poor is nothing more than a rotten fraud, and a dismal failure – giving the apathetic an excuse not to help those in need (nor, to lift so much as a finger, or to get their own hands dirty, for that matter), and the sadly misinformed, yet good-intentioned, a reason not to act!

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Are Natural Rights Man-Made, or Are We Born With Them?

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The following debate originally took place on my Facebook wall, upon my post, “Rights Are NOT Gifts from Government!“…

Rayn: Wake up to the amazing, liberating Truth that Self-Ownership is our BIRTHRIGHT! Yet, one cannot secure such a unique and sacred possession without first acknowledging every other Individual on Earth to hold their very own, as well! And, THIS is the ultimate PROOF of understanding!

"Rights are not gifts from government."

“Rights are not gifts from government.”

Brian K.: According to George Carlin, rights are imaginary. We made them up.

FTF Films – Imaginary Rights:
[youtube_sc url=”NCupmVgQTeQ”]

Rayn:  I’m not sure which “rights” Carlin is referring to, Brian, but you can rest assured that my Natural Right to live is NOT AT ALL imaginary, but a self-evident truth! I was born with it, just like you! Meanwhile, our natural right to Self-Ownership, which is hinged upon our liberty, along with the Non-Aggression Principle, is also self-evident and inborn! Aside from this, our natural right to the justice of a peaceful co-existence, via consensual Cooperation, is also very real and inborn, as we have lived by this Natural Law FROM OUR VERY CONCEPTION – with our lives fully depend upon its productive and reproducible results!

Here is an informative video on the topic, including a good understanding of other property rights that are derived from self-ownership, and a right to exist:

The Philosophy of Liberty:
[youtube_sc url=”WQ3NsLr1al0″]

I shared the picture above to remind others that paper documents, stone tablets and legally fictitious straw-men will NEVER be able to “grant” us what we are already born with. To believe in such dangerous superstitious nonsense is to convert our natural rights into nothing more than “privileges,” to be taken away at any time!

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Vote for Criminals to Rule Humanity, or Live Free?

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The following debate originally took place on my Facebook wall, upon my post, “Why Ask Criminals for Permission to Live Peacefully?“…

Rayn: Why ask criminals for permission to live peacefully?

"If the State gets their authority from the people, then why do we ask the for permission?"

“If the State gets their authority from the people, then why do we ask the for permission?”

Daniel F.: Because too many people seem to have forgotten that fact, and keep voting for the same crooks over and over again. Big money has so infected the system that even those who actually start out with honest intentions have to bend over to appease the corporate big money overlords if they want to have any chance of getting elected and then remaining in office.

That is why the Occupy movement is so vilified – because they know who the real enemy is, and unlike the Tea Party the self-appointed powers-that-be aren’t going to be able to turn them into a seething ball of hate against anything they can get them to perceive as “anti-American” while making sure that their attention is never turned toward the actual enemy – the corporate fatcats and Wall Street banksters.

Rayn: Hmmm… Who did you vote for in America’s 2012 presidential elections, Daniel?

Should “Good Ideas” Be Mandatory, or Is Such Coercion Just Another Form of Slavery?

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The following debate originally took place on my Facebook wall, upon my post, “Good Ideas Don’t Require Force!“…

Rayn: Apparently, the authoritarians among us will continue to arrogantly force their “great ideas” upon us, because REASON and CONSENT are not as important to them as BLIND FAITH and COMPLIANCE!

It’s time for Individuals to wake up, and reject ALL FORMS OF COERCION as illegitimate!

"Good ideas don't require force"

“Good ideas don’t require force”

Jonas A.: That’s right! No “brown” nosing to get us to work for free!  😛

Brian K.: That assumes most people would be smart enough to recognize the good ideas.
“We must view with profound respect the infinite capacity of the human mind to resist the introduction of useful knowledge.”
Thomas R. Lounsbury

Genaire: Brian how would we measure ones intelligence… an iq test? I know several people that would do extremely well on an iq test yet would be unable to survive without the aide of others. I also know several people in school that consider themselves to be very intelligent yet have not tested this intelligence outside the sheltered environment of a classroom. Then one has to ask himself what overlord would one place in charge of determining this said intelligence the government? I know of governments that deemed unintelligent people worthy of extermination. In a free society however one does not have to worry themself about those arrogant few who deem themselves intelligent enough to decide what a good or bad idea may or may not be.

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Withhold Judgement When Unarmed, Non-Combative, Handcuffed Suspect is Tased by Police, or Immediately Demand Justice?

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The following debate originally took place upon the Facebook wall of my friend, Jonas A, after he posted a photo being shared by the page, “Filming Cops“…

Jonas A.: Oink, oink! Gotcha! On Candid Camera!

Disturbing video shows officer tasing handcuffed woman's breast as other cops watch. Beat the police-state-media monopoly. Click share. (graphic by "Filming Cops")

Disturbing video shows officer tasing handcuffed woman’s breast as other cops watch. Beat the police-state-media monopoly. Click share. (graphic by “Filming Cops“)

Rayn: This is OUR tax dollars at work, here… I’m gonna add this coward to the “Wall of Shame” when I find his picture:

http://americanfascismexposed.wordpress.com/wall-of-shame/

Tony K.: This cop could very well have been using excessive force…but I’m not going to trust either a photograph or a video to come to that conclusion. Ever since the Rodney King video and the select few seconds that were shown around the world, I know better than to come to any conclusions based on select footage. Once the facts came out, it turned out that Rodney King wasn’t beaten enough and the injustice was that the cops were brought to trial in the first place.

Rayn: “Once the facts came out, it turned out that Rodney King wasn’t beaten enough and the injustice was that the cops were brought to trial in the first place,” Tony?

Oh, really? And, what “facts” would those be? Please explain exactly how it “turned out that Rodney King wasn’t beaten enough.”

Here is the full video version of Rodney King’s arrest by LA police a decade ago:

Rodney King Beating (Full Version):
[youtube_sc url=”sb1WywIpUtY”]

Starting at 0:50 seconds, KING is CLEARLY being BRUTALLY BEATEN with NIGHTSTICKS OVER AND OVER AGAIN, by multiple police, while he is LYING PROSTRATE – which is the precise moment when handcuffs SHOULD HAVE – and COULD HAVE – EASILY been deployed by any one of them! At 1:05, the assault even continues as King is LYING SUPINE – again, when HANDCUFFS should have been deployed by officers! And, note that there are at least TEN COPS ON THE SCENE, as shown in the video – many of which were STANDING IDLY BY, DOING ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to SUBDUE OR APPREHEND KING. Rather, they simply allowing the brutalization to continue, as if it were the duty of police to PUNISH suspects, rather than to arrest them! Now, recall, that as a result the police assault against him, King suffered from 11 baton-induced skull fractures, including a broken cheek bone, while also sustaining broken teeth, and a broken ankle. He also suffered kidney damage, and some permanent brain damage, too:
http://www.parc.info/client_files/Special%20Reports/1%20-%20Chistopher%20Commision.pdf

Meanwhile, in April of 1993, two of the officers responsible for beating King, Sgt. Stacey Koon and Officer Laurence Powell, were found GUILTY of violating King’s CIVIL RIGHTS, and in August of 1993, were subsequently each sentenced to 30-MONTHS in prison for their CRIMES! More specifically, Powell “was found guilty of violating King’s constitutional right to be free from an arrest made with ‘unreasonable force,'” and Koon was found guilty of letting the crime take place in the first place, since he was the ranking officer on the scene:
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/06/17/rodney-king-what-happened-in-1991/

The next year, in April of 1994, King was awarded $3.8 million in compensatory damages in a civil lawsuit against the city of Los Angeles.

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