The following debate originally took place on my Facebook wall, after I shared a post from here…
Diana D.: Over a hundred rockets fired from Gaza at Israel yesterday, the day of the sabbath….
Rayn: Hmmm… You seem to agree that bombing civilians is wrong… But, it’s also important to recognize the fact that the right to life is actually natural-borne, and not a mere privilege of citizenship…
Diana D.: Those civilians been hijacked by terrorists. #freegazafromhamas
Paul K.: Dual Citizenship I bet, Today is my Sabbath are you throwing BOMB`s today
Rayn: The only thing that Israeli bombs free Gazan civilians from is corporeality… Terrorism is terrorism… Being targeted by it in any way should provide adequate knowledge of its utter illegitimacy, and total immorality. It is always a criminal act, no matter the motivation, and no matter the author.
Paul K.: Did not say it was right but what does the Sabbbath have to do with killing people wrong what ever day even Friday the 13th !
Rayn: No worries. I wasn’t replying to your comment, Paul.
Daphne T.: Rayn then I would expect you to condemn both sides for using weapons on civilian areas. I only hear you attack the Israeli side.
Rayn: Daphne… I’m duty-bound, first and foremost, to condemn the side who’s murdering civilians using my American tax dollars. Failure to do so would imply my complicity in the criminal act.
Diana D.: Your tax dollars also end up in the hands
But you never condem them. Your one sidedness is
Surprising seeing how u hate death so
Much why don’t you care about Palestinian human shields in Gaza??? Lucky
For the poor kids in this park Israel cares
More about their enemies than the dictators of the Gaza Strip
COGAT – Coordination of Government Activities in the Territories:
Rayn: Unlike Israel, Hamas is not considered an American ally, and hence, receives no direct funding from my tax dollars. Whatever cash those criminals manage to launder for themselves is without my knowledge or consent, and does not take place through any legal channels.
And, I condemn all those who murder civilians, regardless of citizenship. You can read above, and within the comments of previous posts I’ve made on the topic.
I generally don’t lead discussions about these issues with posts on Hamas activities because I believe that will only really lend support to the ongoing, US-funded Israeli campaign of bombing civilians. And, of course, it is important to note that Hamas is not very popular, as it is already well-established by the international community to be terrorist organization. It’s also very small, Stateless, unorganized, and ill-funded. Hamas is all-around incapable of racking up same amount of civilian casualties as the well-funded, highly-organized, Britain-US-backed State of Israel. To demand equal levels of condemnation is to imply that Israel and Hamas enjoy equal levels of power, and that their body counts are equal. This simply isn’t the case.
Diana D.: It does take
Place thru legal
Channels. Any aid to gaZans ends up in their hands as Hamas rules the strip. UNRWA, a supposed aid agency has been totally hijacked by Hamas. Until
Trump brought back sensibility to the table the US was UNRWA biggest donor giving 400 mil
Rayn: Since those funds are given by donors with the intention of reaching and assisting Gazan civilians, not for supporting Hamas, they are being misdirected, which is a criminal act…
Rayn: I provided some more relevant commentary on the topic of Israel and Hamas in my August 2014 article, entitled, “Israel Still Continues to Commit Crimes Against Humanity in Their Attack Upon the the Residents of the Gaza Strip,” located here:
If you’ll take note, too, I easily and continuously condemn both parties for their murders of civilians, though I lead with Israel’s crimes, first.
Rayn: As I wrote then, “Much like the terrorist organization, Hamas, Israel’s government clings to the broken logic that terrorizing innocent civilians is a valid political strategy, rather than a crime! For every civilian that Israel’s military murders, Hamas is only given further legitimacy as “just another political party,” simply operating within the framework of the “political reality on the ground” whenever they engage in their own civilian-targeting adventures, just like they’ve been claiming all along…
The irony of the situation is clear: if having one’s civilians targeted for death is just cause to simply murder more civilians, as the Israeli government continues to claim, then by such a pathetic standard, Hamas, much like Israel, suddenly emerges from the equation not as a terrorist group, like most of us thought, but rather, a courageous group of misunderstood heroes simply “defending” their residences and civilians from a decades-long campaign of Israeli government aggression against civilians living within one of the world’s largest open-air refugee prisons. But, it’s a good thing that most don’t subscribe to such an erroneous viewpoint when it comes to Hamas! Yet, the Israeli government’s use of this same rotten reasoning illicits silence from most, and even open encouragement from some!
When terrorist organizations like Hamas and the Israeli government murder civilians back and forth as some sort of “acceptable” means of achieving their respective political agendas, the moral vacuum created by their wanton disregard for human life threatens to expand and envelop the entirety of humanity, if not properly CHECKED! This is especially true when the escalation leading up to today occurred so incrementally, and with so much compartmentalization, that most are unaware of the originating source of the current conflict.
But, considering the dubious relationship between Israel and Hamas, murdered Gazan civilians seems to be a major goal for BOTH parties, with over 1.5 million innocent Gazan refugees trapped in the middle, to be sacrificed as political pawns!”
Rayn: And, the dubious relationship between Israel and Hamas I refer to above *especially* ensures that I never lead any discussions on this topic with condemnation of this terrorist organization’s crimes… It would be irresponsible of me, knowing the truth of their origins.
“How Israel Helped to Spawn Hamas (Jan. 2009 article):
How Israel Helped Create Hamas (July 2014 article):
Analysis – Hamas History Tied to Israel (June 2002 article):
Hamas, Son of Israel (Jan. 2006 article):
Sharon and Hamas (Jan. 2003 article):
And, of course, the US has supported and funded much of the Israeli government’s Hamas-helping endeavors…
America’s Hidden Role in Hamas’s Rise to Power (Jan. 2009 article):
Besides this, the US government is STILL helping to fund Hamas, at this very moment, through Qatar…
Qatar’s Purchase Of Billions Of US Weaponry — And Support For Hamas — Shows How Awkward Foreign Policy Can Be (July 2014 article):
And, the US is well aware of Qatar’s position…
Qatar Challenges Washington on Hamas (Feb. 2009 article):
Qatar’s Emir Visits Gaza, Pledging $400 Million to Hamas (October 2012 article):
Qatar to Pay Salaries of Former Hamas Civil Servants (July 2014 article):
And, let us not forget that Hamas sprang from the Muslim Brotherhood, which was funded and fueled by good ol’ Britian and the US of A:
Macmillan Backed Syria Assassination Plot: Documents Show American and British Intelligence Conspired Over Oil-fuelled Invasion Plan, Including Acts of False-Flag Terrorism, Arming of Terrorists, Stirring of Muslim Brotherhood:
US Gives ‘Direct Access’ Stimulus Grants to the Muslim Brotherhood (Aug. 2009 article):
Muslim Brotherhood Inherits U.S. War Gear (Dec. 2012):
Diana D.: yes, we created hamas. our very presence here makes people wanna blow shit up. including their own children, wives, homes, land, etc. the hate runs that deep…
(All original portions of this work, by Rayn Kleipe, are licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike 4.0 International License, while all redistributed links, images, sounds, videos, and writings are protected under 17 U.S.C. § 107: Fair Use, or under Public Domain)